Mr. Pat Martin (Winnipeg Centre, NDP): Mr. Speaker, let us look at some of the largest beneficiaries in the technology partnerships Canada loans: SNC-Lavalin, $8.7 million in loans, $131,000 donated to the Liberal Party; Spar Aerospace, $4.8 million in loans, $134,000 to the Liberal Party; Bombardier, $87 million in loans, $411,000 donated to the Liberal Party. These lucky companies are contributing to the Liberal Party at a higher rate than they are paying back their loans.

How does the industry minister explain the connection between TPC loans and these huge contributions? What active steps is he taking to ensure these loans are repaid?

Hon. Allan Rock (Minister of Industry, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, the member should know that these are not loans. These are investments made in order to enable these companies to develop technology which turns into jobs and prosperity here in Canada.

Technology partnerships Canada is a program of which we are proud. It is mostly pre-competitive research and development. It shows the way for the future for many Canadian businesses. We will continue to invest in this fashion. It is a proven success.

Mr. Pat Martin (Winnipeg Centre, NDP): Mr. Speaker, if these are supposed to be investments rather than loans, then I presume we now have an equity position in all these companies. Maybe we have shares in all these companies as the Government of Canada.

The whole loans and grants system in the country is out of control. Nine of the last ten TPC grants went to Liberal ridings. The Liberals shovel money to their corporate buddies who dutifully shovel it back into the coffers of the Liberal Party.

What tangible benefits can the industry minister tell us these TPC loans have produced? How does he explain that only 2% of these billions of dollars of loans have ever been repaid?

Hon. Allan Rock (Minister of Industry, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, members should be reminded that the auditor general has looked carefully into the TPC program, has examined the question and has concluded that we have used due diligence with respect to each one of these investments. We make public disclosures through the public accounts of all the money that is invested.

The member is right in his suggestion. Sometimes we do take positions in companies. We are paid royalties. We have warrants that are given sometimes in return for these investments.

The important thing is that Canada, like many other countries, through this program provides money which might not otherwise be available for R and D which enables growth, jobs and prosperity.

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